39. Gratitude and Appreciation
While gratitude and appreciation may seem like exactly the same thing, I find that practicing appreciation feels very different than practicing gratitude (in a fun, wonderful way).
Gratitude is totally a buzzword in the personal development space. There are countless proven benefits of embracing gratitude, physically as well as emotionally, and people generally agree it’s a helpful habit to cultivate.
However, I also see people guilt-tripping themselves around gratitude, and that’s the antithesis of what gratitude is all about. Nothing feels less like true gratitude than the idea that we should be more grateful than we are.
This is one reason that I prefer the lens of appreciation over the lens of gratitude. While they’re similar, appreciation has a slightly different meaning and a slightly different connotation. It’s also why I like the question, “what is working?” Because this question is a way of asking people what they’re grateful for without insisting that they be grateful for it.
They can seek out the information - what’s working, what’s going well, what’s delightful, etc - and enjoy that information without any pressure to “be more grateful” for it. It’s a gentler way to do gratitude, and one that kicks up less guilt and conflicting feelings. It also shows us what we’re truly appreciative of (vs what we feel like we should appreciate).
And that’s great news, because, again, the act of appreciating what is working is feels good and creates lots of benefits, and even more so when you can separate it from that guilt-tripping that so many of us stumble into.
Tune in this week to find out how to do gratitude better, so that you can enjoy more of it and delight in all the bonus benefits appreciation creates.
If you love the podcast and want to take this work deeper, I have great news! I have space for new one-to-one coaching clients starting this month, so click here to schedule a call with me and we’ll see if we’re a good fit to start working together!
If there are topics y’all want me to teach and talk about on the podcast, feel free to write in and let me know by clicking here! I’d love to hear from you!
WHAT YOU’LL LEARN FROM THIS EPISODE:
Why people guilt-tripping themselves around gratitude is such a problem and can even be a form of oppression.
How to see the difference between real gratitude and gratitude-shame.
Why the more marginalized identities you hold, the more pressure you may feel to be grateful.
How to stop feeling guilty for wanting more than you have right now.
Why it’s okay to appreciate what you have while still wanting more.
What I love about using the word appreciation rather than gratitude.
How to experience more appreciation for where you are right now, even if you want to make changes.
LISTEN TO THE FULL EPISODE:
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35. The Pleasure Gloss: The Secret to Creating a Career You Love
FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
This week we’re talking about gratitude and appreciation.
You are listening to Love Your Job Before You Leave It, the podcast for ambitious, high-achieving women who are ready to stop feeling stressed about work and kiss burnout goodbye forever. Whether you’re starting a business or staying in your day job, this show will give you the coaching and guidance you need to start loving your work today. Here’s your host, Career Coach, Kori Linn.
Happy Wednesday. I'm excited to have a conversation with y'all today about gratitude and appreciation. Before we get into that I'm going to share something a little tender for me. Which is we dropped our cat, Cowboy, off this morning to get his teeth cleaned. And he's ancient, he's probably we guess 17 or 18. Alex has had him for 16 years this summer.
But he's in really good health. So we think his teeth are bothering him. They're hurting him and he has like a few that are loose, and they need to be removed. We think they're causing pain. But when cats get their teeth handled, they go under anesthesia unlike humans.
Or maybe humans go under anesthesia for some of it. I've never been. Well, I guess I had my wisdom teeth out. I went under anesthesia for that. So it's like that, right? He's getting his kitty wisdom teeth out except for it's not his wisdom teeth, it's just as normal teeth.
Anyways, and teeth in pets, especially older pets, are interesting because like if they get an infection in their tooth, it can actually be really dangerous. Anyways, the point is we decided to have him undergo this dental procedure even though putting an older cat under anesthesia has some risks.
And Alex and I were talking about it driving home from dropping him off. And we were talking about like, you know, we were feeling really big feelings, because we think that this is the right choice for him. But it's also really scary, because there's a chance that he doesn't make it through the procedure. Or that he doesn't wake up from the anesthesia.
And I was saying, it's just really hard to know what to do. And then my brain totally came in and coached itself. Where it was like, “It's actually not hard.” My brain said to myself, was like, “It's not hard if you have a single guiding principle.” And we do, the single guiding principle is to make sure that our cat has a very high quality of life while he's with us. And if he's not having a high quality of life, then we are willing to let him go.
So while we were having really big feelings about our decision and about the risk, I in that moment, also felt a lot of peace because I realized the decision wasn't hard. When I thought about it logically, through the lens of what matters most to me and to Alex in this situation, that part was easy.
The part I was struggling with was allowing myself to have all the feelings that I was having. I was feeling a lot of fear, I was already preemptively like feeling grief and regret, even though nothing had happened at that point. We were just driving home, he wasn't even in his procedure yet. He probably is in it right now.
And just noticing like my brain wanting to have all these really big feelings. And that that feels scary and hard for a lot of us. Even though this is a podcast about work, and a lot of people think feelings don't have anything to do with work, what I know is that feelings have everything to do with everything. And that so much of building a career and life that you enjoy, and that is satisfying for you, and has meaning for you comes down to allowing yourself to feel the feelings that you feel. And understanding that feeling feelings, even really big intense ones is part of the normal human experience for everybody with a fully functioning human brain.
And no shade if you have a differently functioning human brain. That's a beautiful thing too. It's just going to be a different experience. Like some people don't feel the full spectrum of human emotion. But I'm going to talk about it in the way that most of us do.
So I just thought that was something interesting I wanted to share with y'all, even though it's tender and raw for me. And when this podcast is being recorded, I don't know what the future holds with Cowboy. So I'll have to tell you about it next week. By the time the podcast comes out, we'll know because I record these in advance.
But I thought it was something meaningful to share with you because this is something all of you are experiencing all the time too. You're making decisions in your life and sometimes it feels really fucking hard to decide what the thing is you want to do.
And I'm not even going to say what the right thing to do is because I don't think there's a right thing to do and a wrong thing. It's like very rarely that black and white, it's usually much more gray. It's what are the values that you want to filter your decisions through? What actually matters to you? And with the choices you have, how do you want to honor what matters most to you?
So I wanted to share my experience with that because I think it could be useful for y'all. And even when it comes to work decisions. I know so many people are biting their nails laying awake at night wondering if it's time to leave their job, or if it's time to ask their boss for a promotion, or whatever the thing is.
And I know that in those moments we can have that thing where it feels really hard. So just ask yourself like, “What if it's not really hard? What if it's very simple, but I just have a lot of complex feelings for me to feel?” Because that's really different.
It's one thing to be doing a complex equation about what you would like to do. It's another thing to realize that it's actually really simple what you would like to do, and the complex equation bit is actually just allowing yourself to feel the complex equation of feelings.
Okay, just a little lesson on thoughts and feelings for y'all. Now, let's get into our topic today, which is gratitude and appreciation. And there's a reason that I'm talking about both. Gratitude gets a lot of press, it gets a lot of buzz.
It's one of those things that there's like a bajillion studies about all the ways it's really good and beneficial for you. I'm not even going to get into all of those here, you can do a quick Google search on your end if you want to know what they all are.
Suffice it to say, gratitude makes us happier. And it can have all kinds of other benefits for us. It can benefit our health, it can benefit our relationships, it can definitely benefit us at work. There is so much data on this that you can review.
And as a coach, this makes a lot of sense. Because gratitude happens in our mind, right? Gratitude is a mindset, it's a thought pattern. A thought pattern of grateful thoughts will lead to positive feelings. That makes total sense to me.
Here's the thing though, what I also see happen with gratitude is people guilt tripping themselves. And I don't think this is an accident. I think this happens because we live in a culture that teaches us both things like rampant consumerism, but also that we should be grateful for what we have.
And let's just say nothing makes anyone feel less grateful than the sentence, you should be grateful for what you have. And yet, that's a sentence that many of us are saying to ourselves all day long. I see this happen all the time with my clients.
I see it happen all the time in my own brain, because a big part of being a coach for me is observing my own brain and seeing what the fuck it's doing. Because even though we're all special, beautiful, unique individuals, many of us have a lot of the same thought patterns. So studying my brain helps me understand what all of your brains are doing.
So I talked about this a little bit last week in the episode on money and salary negotiation. That a thing that happens with women is that we tell ourselves we should just be grateful for what we have. And we highlight all the ways that what we have is really good. And we highlight all the people who don't have what we have.
And at first glance, that might look like gratitude. But I think it's often what I'm going to call gratitude shame. So, a key way you can tell the difference between gratitude and gratitude shame, is gratitude feels amazing and wonderful and gratitude shame feels like shit.
So while there is all this amazing data that says that gratitude is so helpful and powerful, you may find yourself having difficulty tapping into that in your own life. It sounds really simple, right? Just be grateful for what you have. Just be grateful for what's already working.
And listen, y'all know me, I'm all about, like, let's make those what's working lists, let's focus on what's working. But there's a reason I call it what's working versus gratitude. And the reason is, a lot of us have stuff in our lives that we feel like we “should be grateful for” that we do not fucking feel grateful for.
But we have other things in our lives that we're like, “Oh, this is working” and when I notice it's working, that's fun. But if we thought, “Oh, I should feel gratitude about that” we might actually not feel gratitude, we might feel that gratitude shame that I was talking about.
And when I say we have this, I mean women, I also mean people with marginalized identities. And if you have a lot of marginalized identities, you might feel even more pressure to be grateful. And that is that external oppression that becomes internal oppression.
And you might be a little bit confused by that because you might be like, why is it oppressive to be thinking you should be grateful? But when we live in a culture where we are not given access in a way that is equitable, then being told be grateful for what we have is a form of oppression.
So for example, if you're part of a marginalized group, or if you are a person who has one or many marginalized identities and you don't have equitable access to something, telling yourself to be grateful or someone else telling you to be grateful about the access you have that's not equitable, it's not that that's wrong or bad but it can be a way that things like white supremacy and patriarchy keep people in oppressed situations.
So for instance, if you're thinking I should just be grateful for the pay I make, and then you're not negotiating or asking to get the pay that is equal to the role you have or the value you offer at work. You're always allowed to do that if you want to.
You're always allowed to be like, “This pay is good enough and I'm just going to be grateful for it. Because I don't really want to fuck around with having that conversation or getting a new job.” You're allowed to do that anytime you want. And that's not necessarily internal oppression.
But when you think like, “Oh, I should be grateful, instead of asking for what I want, or what is equal to the contributions I'm making.” That's where I think it gets into the realm of being oppression.
And actually, I just understood something about this when I was explaining it to you that I can now go into more clarification on. Which is like gratitude is always a beautiful option when you want to do it. And I don't think it has to be like, just gratitude, right?
So you can be like, Yes, I am really grateful for my $80,000 a year salary. And I also know that other people in this same role with this same title are making 100 grand. So I'm going to be grateful for the 80 grand, and I'm also going to go make that 100. I'm going to make that leap.
So to me, that's an example of being grateful without gratitude shaming yourself or keeping yourself stuck at the level you're at. Because you're letting the gratitude become kind of like the only thing you're doing there.
And I think this is a really important distinction, not just for gratitude, but also for like those what is working lists that we talk about and do all the time here on the podcast. Any time I recommend that you make a list of what is working, it's not so that you just have a list of what is working, and then you just stay in the same spot.
I mean, you're allowed to do that always if you're like, “Actually, now that I've reviewed what is working, I feel great. I'm happy where I'm at.” Great, wonderful. You get to decide what career satisfaction looks like for you. And I'm very delighted if that's all you need to change, wonderful.
But it's also a way that we help ourselves create a baseline from which we can make other moves if we want to make those other moves. So the what is working list is step one. And then from the place of having reminded ourselves that things are working and balanced out that natural negativity bias that we talk about all the time. That is the place from which you can come up with creative solutions, and strategies, and ideas for taking any other action you might need to take to get to the place you want to be.
So again, if we go back to that example with the salary, you can be grateful for your 80k. And then from that place of like this part is working, I’m 80% of the way there. How am I going to get that last 20% if I've decided that that matters for me?
With that being said let's add one more little caveat about gratitude shaming, which is the difference between gratitude and gratitude shame, it's kind of complex. But if we just simplify it down the main difference is the word should.
If you are thinking, I should be grateful, you are putting pressure on yourself to be grateful. You're telling yourself in order to be good, or right, or even like in order to feel happier I have to be grateful. And that logically might make sense. But I mean, you can check in with yourself.
But for me it puts pressure on me and it makes gratitude the good thing to do. And then it's almost like I'm like people pleasing myself by trying to do gratitude. And then I feel resentful and rebellious, and I don't want to do gratitude and I want to like karate chop it.
And then I maybe feel resentful and rebellious, and I maybe don't want to do the gratitude, even though I know it's “good for me” and could help me feel better.
And see it in that language of like good for me. When we say things are good for us or put any should on them, we put any like “this is the way to do it” it takes our agency away and it makes it not about our choice. And I think it really strips a lot of the joy and delight out of gratitude.
So that's what I want to point out for y'all. And if you've had a gratitude practice forever and it's working really well for you, you can feel free to ignore everything I've just said.
But if you find that sometimes it feels not great, and you get that kind of shitty feeling. And you feel guilty for not being more grateful, and you feel guilty for wanting more than you have, then, yeah, double back around and maybe even listen to this episode a few times. Because I think that could be what's happening.
Especially like when I said, we receive so many messages about how we should be grateful. It's kind of like I love vegetables and eat a lot of them. And they feel really good in my body when I eat them. But if I think I should eat vegetables, then I feel like sulky and like, “Don't you tell me what to do.”
The same thing is true with gratitude. We don't need to like bossy parent ourselves about it. Sometimes we maybe need to parent ourselves a little bit. But I always think like, what kind of parent do I want to be to myself? And what kind of parenting, what kind of self-talk is going to help me create more of the life I want and not just like rebel against all these “good things” I “should be doing.”
Okay. So that's gratitude and gratitude shame. Let us also talk about appreciation. So, when I practice gratitude, I tend to not even use the word gratitude. I use the word appreciation because I have less of an internal attitude problem about it. Again, the whole like you should be grateful thing, it gets my hackles up. And that's just me.
And could I do the coaching work with myself on changing how I feel about the word gratitude? I totally could. But I'm just not going to. The same way like I don't really use the word exercise. I use the word movement because exercise is so loaded for women who grew up in our culture. And I find the same to be true for me with gratitude. So I just am like, “Yeah, what if there's another word that I could use?” And there is.
Okay, so why do I like the word appreciation? There's a few reasons. One, I don't have that immediate attitude problem about it. Two, I like its definitions, and here they are. One, a feeling or expression of admiration, approval, or gratitude. So gratitude is still included in there, it's just not in the main word. Two, it can mean judgment or evaluation. Like if you have an appreciation of a situation, it means you understand it.
And three, it means an increase in value. So in this way it's like when you buy a house, if the value of the house goes up over time, it appreciates. And this is why I like this. I love this little piece of the definition because one little mental trick I like to play with myself is appreciating what I want more of. And the idea that when I appreciate things, which is when I slow down to pause, to notice, to enjoy them, to delight in them, when I take the time to revel in what is working and appreciate it, I get more of it.
Now, there are a few ways I get more of it. Way number one is when we slow down to appreciate what we appreciate. To take the time to actually do the action of appreciating it, then we get to spend more time with it.
If I'm rushing through my morning and not even tasting my coffee, then I'm not experiencing it. I'm drinking it but I'm not experiencing the delight with it because I'm not paying any fucking attention. Whereas if I pause to appreciate it, then I also get more value.
I get more time with it because I'm paying attention. It's not like literally more time, right? I could be drinking a coffee in five minutes either way. But way one it's like I'm absent from the experience. Whereas way two when I'm appreciating it, I'm actually getting the time with the thing.
And it doesn't have to just be a thing, it could be a person, it could be my beloved cat. So I think that's the first way we increase the value is we actually experience it. And that is an increase both in our joy, but also in the experience of whatever the thing is that we're appreciating.
Here's the other thing though, when we take time to notice and enjoy things, and to appreciate them, we often get more of it because we do more of it. If I'm rushing through my life not noticing how much I enjoy something, then I might not add more of that something to my life because I'm not even really experiencing the part of it I am adding.
So I need an example here because otherwise I don't know if this makes sense. Let's just say I go out to dinner with a friend. And I am really present and I really enjoy the experience. And I notice and appreciate how much I enjoy her company.
If I have noticed and appreciated and been there, first of all, I've really experienced the dinner with her. But I might leave that dinner and think, “I really loved that. I appreciated getting to see her, it was such a delightful experience. And I'd like to have more of it.” And then I create more of it in my life.
So I think when we appreciate things emotionally, when we take time to savor and delight in them, which is a way of being grateful, then I think we also get more of them. Not like magically, I think we actually get more of them because we create more of them with our own actions and efforts because having noticed how much we enjoy them, it motivates us to do that.
And this isn't just for things like hanging out with friends and having a delicious coffee. I think this also is so important in our work. So when you take time to notice and enjoy and appreciate the parts of your job that you like more, first of all, you're going to be paying more attention to them when they're happening. So you'll probably do a better job and maybe enjoy them more while they're happening. But then I think you'll also be more likely to do more of them to add more value in that way.
And this can look a couple different ways. Like if you have a business where you need to get clients, if that's what your job is and you notice and enjoy your efforts in getting clients, and create appreciation and good feelings, that will inspire you to go out and do more actions to get more clients.
And that's really important. Because as we know, those of us who have client-based businesses, we often are talking to many different people in the process of getting like one or two or five clients. So we maybe need to be able to keep going when things don't work on the first try.
And like if your job is writing code and you begin to appreciate yourself and the code for the code that's going well, that'll give you more motivation and inspiration to keep working on the code when it's not going well. When it's not working. When the program you're trying to write just doesn't do the thing you want it to do.
So in a way it's very much like the traditional gratitude practice. But I find that just swapping the name out really changes my experience of it and allows me to think about it in a really different way. Like I think about it in almost like investment terms. There's this way that with gratitude my brain is like, “Oh, I should do that because it's good for you and then you'll be happy.” And you would think that would sell me on it, but it just fucking doesn't.
Whereas when I'm like, “Ooh, appreciating things feels really good. And it's an investment that's going to give me an ROI of more joy later.” And then I think it's also important that we just talk about neuroplasticity and neural pathways.
So whether you call it gratitude or appreciation, when you spend more time doing this, like we always say, first of all it feels fucking amazing. Second of all, you're creating more neural pathways about the light, about appreciation, about gratitude, about joy. The more time you spend noticing and enjoying what is working, the stronger those neural pathways will be.
And I think it's also worth looping back to discuss one more time, gratitude shame. Because if what you're actually practicing is gratitude shame, then the more you do that, the more even the word gratitude is going to be displeasing because it's creating an associative connection between the idea of gratitude and suffering. The idea of gratitude and shame.
So if you remember a couple episodes back, we talked about the pleasure gloss. Which is an associative connection when you like things. This is the opposite, the displeasure glass. Which is an associative connection when you dislike things.
If we try to do something over and over but it feels terrible, even thinking about doing that thing will create a terrible feeling for us and dissuade us from doing it. So if you want to have a strong gratitude or appreciation practice, you've got to make it feel good for you. If it feels like a terrible chore and makes you feel bad about yourself and feel guilty for not being happier with what you have, that's not gratitude. And you're not going to want to keep doing it because it feels terrible.
So when we think about appreciating what's going well, writing those appreciation lists or gratitude lists, if unlike me, you don't have a huge attitude problem about the word gratitude. When you think about writing those lists, it is about noticing what's working. It's about noticing what's delightful. It's about noticing what you'd like more of.
And here's a way you can think about it, if you don't appreciate what you're doing, what you've done, what's going well, why would you do more of it or get more of it, or orient your life around having more of it?
So appreciation feels really good. I know I've said that a million times. I'm just going to keep saying it a million times, because I don't think it's a point that can be overstated. But it also creates real life changes, real world changes.
If you think about someone who is trying to make a big change in their life, maybe they're trying to make a habit change, or they're working on a project. Let's just say someone's like writing a novel outside of work hours. And every day they only write for like 15 minutes.
And that's how they think of it. They're like, “Well, I only wrote for 15 minutes.” And they're like reticent. They don't want to be proud of themselves because they think that's not enough time. That's not enough effort. It's not close enough to their goal for them to be proud of themselves. Well, what does that do? What it creates is a displeasure gloss. They don't want to do more of it because the amount they're doing of it doesn't feel good now.
But if we look at it, if we just look at it factually. If we look at the data, if you're writing 15 minutes a day, that's over an hour a week. I can't do that full math in my head. But even if you're writing 10 minutes a day, that's 70 minutes a week, which is over an hour.
So 15 is like 1.5 times that. Which is let's say I think it's 105. So maybe I did do that math in my head. The math may or may not be correct, but the point is on point, okay? If you don't appreciate 5 or 10 minutes, why would you do 15 or 20? If you don't appreciate 15 or 20, why would you do 30? If you don't appreciate what is, why pursue more of it.
So when we choose to appreciate what we want to have more of, whether it's more words on our novel written. Or whether it's more dinners out with our friends like my other example. Or the ability to speak up more in meetings. Or the ability to stay calm when you receive critical feedback. Whatever it is, noticing and appreciating what's working is one of the ways you create more of it.
Appreciation creates appreciation, right? It creates the really good feeling. But it also creates the thing where we get more of it, both in the moment and in the future. Because what we appreciate, we will do more of.
And I just want to say if you're having a hard time thinking of something to appreciate, that's pretty normal because of the negativity bias. And don't let your brain come in there and shame you for that, and should you, and tell you should be more grateful, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. We all know that's not helping. It's not working. It's not making you feel better. It's not appreciation.
Here's one simple question that can help you identify things you actually appreciate, even if you're not currently noticing them. And the question is, what would past me think is a miracle that's common now? So if past you met you now, what about your current life would they think is a fucking miracle, but it's commonplace to now? You like don't even notice it.
And there can be tons of examples of this. Like, right now, my student loans are totally paid off, and I paid them off at 34. So three years ago. Past me would think that was fucking insane in a miraculous way. Younger Kori thought she was never going to pay her student loans off. She thought she was going to die with them.
And I am referring to her in the third person even though it's me. But that's because in this way we feel like such different people. I never think about my student loans anymore. When I still had them, I thought about them all the fucking time. And I thought about what a failure I was, blah, blah, blah, a bunch of unhelpful thoughts. So this thing that I never think about would be a miracle to past me.
And there's so much stuff like this in your life, right? Like another one is having my own business. Past me wanted to have her own business. She didn't want to work 40 hours a week. She wanted to do work and earn money helping people have more enjoyable, fun lives. She couldn't figure out how to do that. I mean, one of the past mes did. But the past me I'm talking about was way before that.
So I became the person who could do that. It's commonplace to me now. My business is commonplace to me now. I've been in business for three years. I still love it, but it's not the honeymoon. I don't wake up every day thinking, “Oh my god!” I'm like, “Yes, this is my life. I designed it, I'm going to have a walk. I'm glad I didn't have to get up till eight because I designed my life that way.”
But if I want to feel that appreciation and use that appreciation as fuel to do more of what I want to have done in the world, and push towards my future goals that would be a miracle to current me, but will be commonplace to future me. Asking myself this question is one way I can do that. And you can use the question too.
And no matter where you are in your life right now, there is at least one thing, the past you would think is a fucking miracle. You just have to be willing to see it, and find it, and spend more time thinking about it. Rather than letting your brain and its natural negativity bias tell you that everything's terrible and you should feel like shit all the time.
Or that your life is good and so you should be grateful, even if you want to actually change shit. And you don't actually want to be grateful for the things it's telling you to be grateful for.
So let's just review. Gratitude feels really good and amazing, but we're taught to be grateful. So sometimes when we think about gratitude, we don't feel amazing and instead we feel shitty. Which I call gratitude shame.
You need to understand which one you're doing and practice true gratitude because practicing the other one is just going to feel like shit and create more negative neural pathways. Which you're allowed to do, but I don't think it's super fun.
And if the whole idea of gratitude doesn't delight you, I offer you my ideas about appreciation and about thinking about what do you have in your life that you want more of it? And thinking about it with that like ROI like, oh, the more I notice and enjoy what I want more of, the more I'll get more of that. Both by enjoying it where it already exists, and because I will create more when I noticed how much I actually already love it.
And if you don't like either of those words, if you don't like gratitude, if you don't like appreciation, that's cool. You can still tap into this. You can do a list about what's working. You can do a list about what's amazing. You can do a list about what you like. You can do a list about what you're celebrating. It doesn't even have to be things you've done you're celebrating, you could be celebrating anything.
And you can also think about what you want to do after that. Like we talked about before with if you're making 80k a year, but you want to make 100k a year. You can list what's amazing, and what you're grateful for, or what you appreciate.
And then you can also think about like what am I doing next? And what do I want to do with these good feelings? Let me notice and enjoy what's working. And then where am I life do I want to take that fuel and what do I want to make in that area?
All right y'all, those are my ideas for you today. Take them for a test drive, see what comes up for you. And one more thing, from everything I read, doing this practice in a written format is spectacular. But I'm also a pragmatist, so do it whatever way you want to. Do it in pictures, do it in ideas, do it in words, do it in whatever you want.
One of my clients does like illustrations. Do it in illustrations. They can be stick figures, it can be spectacular. Have fun with it because that is the fucking point. Create a pleasure gloss, pair it with something that feels really good for you, rewire your brain, and see what happens. It's going to be amazing.
And if you love what I teach, and you want some help taking things a little bit deeper and figuring out how this all applies to your own life, I've got good news for you. I've got space for a few new one on one coaching clients starting this month. So let's hop on a call. I'll give you some coaching right away to help you get going. And if it seems like a good fit, I will share with you how we can work together. Just head on over to my website and click on the work with me button and get started there.
Also, bonus, my coaching offering is totally virtual so as to better serve my global audience. And yes, I do work with people who are not native English speakers and we've had great success doing that. There's even a testimonial on my website with someone in that category so you can check that out on the testimonials page. All right y'all, have a lovely week and I will talk to you next time. Bye.
Thank you for listening to Love Your Job Before You Leave It. We'll have another episode for you next week. And in the meantime, if you're feeling super fired up, head on over to korilinn.com for more guidance and resources.
You are listening to Love Your Job Before You Leave It, the podcast for ambitious, high-achieving women who are ready to stop feeling stressed about work and kiss burnout goodbye forever. Whether you’re starting a business or staying in your day job, this show will give you the coaching and guidance you need to start loving your work today. Here’s your host, Career Coach, Kori Linn.
Happy Wednesday. I'm excited to have a conversation with y'all today about gratitude and appreciation. Before we get into that I'm going to share something a little tender for me. Which is we dropped our cat, Cowboy, off this morning to get his teeth cleaned. And he's ancient, he's probably we guess 17 or 18. Alex has had him for 16 years this summer.
But he's in really good health. So we think his teeth are bothering him. They're hurting him and he has like a few that are loose, and they need to be removed. We think they're causing pain. But when cats get their teeth handled, they go under anesthesia unlike humans.
Or maybe humans go under anesthesia for some of it. I've never been. Well, I guess I had my wisdom teeth out. I went under anesthesia for that. So it's like that, right? He's getting his kitty wisdom teeth out except for it's not his wisdom teeth, it's just as normal teeth.
Anyways, and teeth in pets, especially older pets, are interesting because like if they get an infection in their tooth, it can actually be really dangerous. Anyways, the point is we decided to have him undergo this dental procedure even though putting an older cat under anesthesia has some risks.
And Alex and I were talking about it driving home from dropping him off. And we were talking about like, you know, we were feeling really big feelings, because we think that this is the right choice for him. But it's also really scary, because there's a chance that he doesn't make it through the procedure. Or that he doesn't wake up from the anesthesia.
And I was saying, it's just really hard to know what to do. And then my brain totally came in and coached itself. Where it was like, “It's actually not hard.” My brain said to myself, was like, “It's not hard if you have a single guiding principle.” And we do, the single guiding principle is to make sure that our cat has a very high quality of life while he's with us. And if he's not having a high quality of life, then we are willing to let him go.
So while we were having really big feelings about our decision and about the risk, I in that moment, also felt a lot of peace because I realized the decision wasn't hard. When I thought about it logically, through the lens of what matters most to me and to Alex in this situation, that part was easy.
The part I was struggling with was allowing myself to have all the feelings that I was having. I was feeling a lot of fear, I was already preemptively like feeling grief and regret, even though nothing had happened at that point. We were just driving home, he wasn't even in his procedure yet. He probably is in it right now.
And just noticing like my brain wanting to have all these really big feelings. And that that feels scary and hard for a lot of us. Even though this is a podcast about work, and a lot of people think feelings don't have anything to do with work, what I know is that feelings have everything to do with everything. And that so much of building a career and life that you enjoy, and that is satisfying for you, and has meaning for you comes down to allowing yourself to feel the feelings that you feel. And understanding that feeling feelings, even really big intense ones is part of the normal human experience for everybody with a fully functioning human brain.
And no shade if you have a differently functioning human brain. That's a beautiful thing too. It's just going to be a different experience. Like some people don't feel the full spectrum of human emotion. But I'm going to talk about it in the way that most of us do.
So I just thought that was something interesting I wanted to share with y'all, even though it's tender and raw for me. And when this podcast is being recorded, I don't know what the future holds with Cowboy. So I'll have to tell you about it next week. By the time the podcast comes out, we'll know because I record these in advance.
But I thought it was something meaningful to share with you because this is something all of you are experiencing all the time too. You're making decisions in your life and sometimes it feels really fucking hard to decide what the thing is you want to do.
And I'm not even going to say what the right thing to do is because I don't think there's a right thing to do and a wrong thing. It's like very rarely that black and white, it's usually much more gray. It's what are the values that you want to filter your decisions through? What actually matters to you? And with the choices you have, how do you want to honor what matters most to you?
So I wanted to share my experience with that because I think it could be useful for y'all. And even when it comes to work decisions. I know so many people are biting their nails laying awake at night wondering if it's time to leave their job, or if it's time to ask their boss for a promotion, or whatever the thing is.
And I know that in those moments we can have that thing where it feels really hard. So just ask yourself like, “What if it's not really hard? What if it's very simple, but I just have a lot of complex feelings for me to feel?” Because that's really different.
It's one thing to be doing a complex equation about what you would like to do. It's another thing to realize that it's actually really simple what you would like to do, and the complex equation bit is actually just allowing yourself to feel the complex equation of feelings.
Okay, just a little lesson on thoughts and feelings for y'all. Now, let's get into our topic today, which is gratitude and appreciation. And there's a reason that I'm talking about both. Gratitude gets a lot of press, it gets a lot of buzz.
It's one of those things that there's like a bajillion studies about all the ways it's really good and beneficial for you. I'm not even going to get into all of those here, you can do a quick Google search on your end if you want to know what they all are.
Suffice it to say, gratitude makes us happier. And it can have all kinds of other benefits for us. It can benefit our health, it can benefit our relationships, it can definitely benefit us at work. There is so much data on this that you can review.
And as a coach, this makes a lot of sense. Because gratitude happens in our mind, right? Gratitude is a mindset, it's a thought pattern. A thought pattern of grateful thoughts will lead to positive feelings. That makes total sense to me.
Here's the thing though, what I also see happen with gratitude is people guilt tripping themselves. And I don't think this is an accident. I think this happens because we live in a culture that teaches us both things like rampant consumerism, but also that we should be grateful for what we have.
And let's just say nothing makes anyone feel less grateful than the sentence, you should be grateful for what you have. And yet, that's a sentence that many of us are saying to ourselves all day long. I see this happen all the time with my clients.
I see it happen all the time in my own brain, because a big part of being a coach for me is observing my own brain and seeing what the fuck it's doing. Because even though we're all special, beautiful, unique individuals, many of us have a lot of the same thought patterns. So studying my brain helps me understand what all of your brains are doing.
So I talked about this a little bit last week in the episode on money and salary negotiation. That a thing that happens with women is that we tell ourselves we should just be grateful for what we have. And we highlight all the ways that what we have is really good. And we highlight all the people who don't have what we have.
And at first glance, that might look like gratitude. But I think it's often what I'm going to call gratitude shame. So, a key way you can tell the difference between gratitude and gratitude shame, is gratitude feels amazing and wonderful and gratitude shame feels like shit.
So while there is all this amazing data that says that gratitude is so helpful and powerful, you may find yourself having difficulty tapping into that in your own life. It sounds really simple, right? Just be grateful for what you have. Just be grateful for what's already working.
And listen, y'all know me, I'm all about, like, let's make those what's working lists, let's focus on what's working. But there's a reason I call it what's working versus gratitude. And the reason is, a lot of us have stuff in our lives that we feel like we “should be grateful for” that we do not fucking feel grateful for.
But we have other things in our lives that we're like, “Oh, this is working” and when I notice it's working, that's fun. But if we thought, “Oh, I should feel gratitude about that” we might actually not feel gratitude, we might feel that gratitude shame that I was talking about.
And when I say we have this, I mean women, I also mean people with marginalized identities. And if you have a lot of marginalized identities, you might feel even more pressure to be grateful. And that is that external oppression that becomes internal oppression.
And you might be a little bit confused by that because you might be like, why is it oppressive to be thinking you should be grateful? But when we live in a culture where we are not given access in a way that is equitable, then being told be grateful for what we have is a form of oppression.
So for example, if you're part of a marginalized group, or if you are a person who has one or many marginalized identities and you don't have equitable access to something, telling yourself to be grateful or someone else telling you to be grateful about the access you have that's not equitable, it's not that that's wrong or bad but it can be a way that things like white supremacy and patriarchy keep people in oppressed situations.
So for instance, if you're thinking I should just be grateful for the pay I make, and then you're not negotiating or asking to get the pay that is equal to the role you have or the value you offer at work. You're always allowed to do that if you want to.
You're always allowed to be like, “This pay is good enough and I'm just going to be grateful for it. Because I don't really want to fuck around with having that conversation or getting a new job.” You're allowed to do that anytime you want. And that's not necessarily internal oppression.
But when you think like, “Oh, I should be grateful, instead of asking for what I want, or what is equal to the contributions I'm making.” That's where I think it gets into the realm of being oppression.
And actually, I just understood something about this when I was explaining it to you that I can now go into more clarification on. Which is like gratitude is always a beautiful option when you want to do it. And I don't think it has to be like, just gratitude, right?
So you can be like, Yes, I am really grateful for my $80,000 a year salary. And I also know that other people in this same role with this same title are making 100 grand. So I'm going to be grateful for the 80 grand, and I'm also going to go make that 100. I'm going to make that leap.
So to me, that's an example of being grateful without gratitude shaming yourself or keeping yourself stuck at the level you're at. Because you're letting the gratitude become kind of like the only thing you're doing there.
And I think this is a really important distinction, not just for gratitude, but also for like those what is working lists that we talk about and do all the time here on the podcast. Any time I recommend that you make a list of what is working, it's not so that you just have a list of what is working, and then you just stay in the same spot.
I mean, you're allowed to do that always if you're like, “Actually, now that I've reviewed what is working, I feel great. I'm happy where I'm at.” Great, wonderful. You get to decide what career satisfaction looks like for you. And I'm very delighted if that's all you need to change, wonderful.
But it's also a way that we help ourselves create a baseline from which we can make other moves if we want to make those other moves. So the what is working list is step one. And then from the place of having reminded ourselves that things are working and balanced out that natural negativity bias that we talk about all the time. That is the place from which you can come up with creative solutions, and strategies, and ideas for taking any other action you might need to take to get to the place you want to be.
So again, if we go back to that example with the salary, you can be grateful for your 80k. And then from that place of like this part is working, I’m 80% of the way there. How am I going to get that last 20% if I've decided that that matters for me?
With that being said let's add one more little caveat about gratitude shaming, which is the difference between gratitude and gratitude shame, it's kind of complex. But if we just simplify it down the main difference is the word should.
If you are thinking, I should be grateful, you are putting pressure on yourself to be grateful. You're telling yourself in order to be good, or right, or even like in order to feel happier I have to be grateful. And that logically might make sense. But I mean, you can check in with yourself.
But for me it puts pressure on me and it makes gratitude the good thing to do. And then it's almost like I'm like people pleasing myself by trying to do gratitude. And then I feel resentful and rebellious, and I don't want to do gratitude and I want to like karate chop it.
And then I maybe feel resentful and rebellious, and I maybe don't want to do the gratitude, even though I know it's “good for me” and could help me feel better.
And see it in that language of like good for me. When we say things are good for us or put any should on them, we put any like “this is the way to do it” it takes our agency away and it makes it not about our choice. And I think it really strips a lot of the joy and delight out of gratitude.
So that's what I want to point out for y'all. And if you've had a gratitude practice forever and it's working really well for you, you can feel free to ignore everything I've just said.
But if you find that sometimes it feels not great, and you get that kind of shitty feeling. And you feel guilty for not being more grateful, and you feel guilty for wanting more than you have, then, yeah, double back around and maybe even listen to this episode a few times. Because I think that could be what's happening.
Especially like when I said, we receive so many messages about how we should be grateful. It's kind of like I love vegetables and eat a lot of them. And they feel really good in my body when I eat them. But if I think I should eat vegetables, then I feel like sulky and like, “Don't you tell me what to do.”
The same thing is true with gratitude. We don't need to like bossy parent ourselves about it. Sometimes we maybe need to parent ourselves a little bit. But I always think like, what kind of parent do I want to be to myself? And what kind of parenting, what kind of self-talk is going to help me create more of the life I want and not just like rebel against all these “good things” I “should be doing.”
Okay. So that's gratitude and gratitude shame. Let us also talk about appreciation. So, when I practice gratitude, I tend to not even use the word gratitude. I use the word appreciation because I have less of an internal attitude problem about it. Again, the whole like you should be grateful thing, it gets my hackles up. And that's just me.
And could I do the coaching work with myself on changing how I feel about the word gratitude? I totally could. But I'm just not going to. The same way like I don't really use the word exercise. I use the word movement because exercise is so loaded for women who grew up in our culture. And I find the same to be true for me with gratitude. So I just am like, “Yeah, what if there's another word that I could use?” And there is.
Okay, so why do I like the word appreciation? There's a few reasons. One, I don't have that immediate attitude problem about it. Two, I like its definitions, and here they are. One, a feeling or expression of admiration, approval, or gratitude. So gratitude is still included in there, it's just not in the main word. Two, it can mean judgment or evaluation. Like if you have an appreciation of a situation, it means you understand it.
And three, it means an increase in value. So in this way it's like when you buy a house, if the value of the house goes up over time, it appreciates. And this is why I like this. I love this little piece of the definition because one little mental trick I like to play with myself is appreciating what I want more of. And the idea that when I appreciate things, which is when I slow down to pause, to notice, to enjoy them, to delight in them, when I take the time to revel in what is working and appreciate it, I get more of it.
Now, there are a few ways I get more of it. Way number one is when we slow down to appreciate what we appreciate. To take the time to actually do the action of appreciating it, then we get to spend more time with it.
If I'm rushing through my morning and not even tasting my coffee, then I'm not experiencing it. I'm drinking it but I'm not experiencing the delight with it because I'm not paying any fucking attention. Whereas if I pause to appreciate it, then I also get more value.
I get more time with it because I'm paying attention. It's not like literally more time, right? I could be drinking a coffee in five minutes either way. But way one it's like I'm absent from the experience. Whereas way two when I'm appreciating it, I'm actually getting the time with the thing.
And it doesn't have to just be a thing, it could be a person, it could be my beloved cat. So I think that's the first way we increase the value is we actually experience it. And that is an increase both in our joy, but also in the experience of whatever the thing is that we're appreciating.
Here's the other thing though, when we take time to notice and enjoy things, and to appreciate them, we often get more of it because we do more of it. If I'm rushing through my life not noticing how much I enjoy something, then I might not add more of that something to my life because I'm not even really experiencing the part of it I am adding.
So I need an example here because otherwise I don't know if this makes sense. Let's just say I go out to dinner with a friend. And I am really present and I really enjoy the experience. And I notice and appreciate how much I enjoy her company.
If I have noticed and appreciated and been there, first of all, I've really experienced the dinner with her. But I might leave that dinner and think, “I really loved that. I appreciated getting to see her, it was such a delightful experience. And I'd like to have more of it.” And then I create more of it in my life.
So I think when we appreciate things emotionally, when we take time to savor and delight in them, which is a way of being grateful, then I think we also get more of them. Not like magically, I think we actually get more of them because we create more of them with our own actions and efforts because having noticed how much we enjoy them, it motivates us to do that.
And this isn't just for things like hanging out with friends and having a delicious coffee. I think this also is so important in our work. So when you take time to notice and enjoy and appreciate the parts of your job that you like more, first of all, you're going to be paying more attention to them when they're happening. So you'll probably do a better job and maybe enjoy them more while they're happening. But then I think you'll also be more likely to do more of them to add more value in that way.
And this can look a couple different ways. Like if you have a business where you need to get clients, if that's what your job is and you notice and enjoy your efforts in getting clients, and create appreciation and good feelings, that will inspire you to go out and do more actions to get more clients.
And that's really important. Because as we know, those of us who have client-based businesses, we often are talking to many different people in the process of getting like one or two or five clients. So we maybe need to be able to keep going when things don't work on the first try.
And like if your job is writing code and you begin to appreciate yourself and the code for the code that's going well, that'll give you more motivation and inspiration to keep working on the code when it's not going well. When it's not working. When the program you're trying to write just doesn't do the thing you want it to do.
So in a way it's very much like the traditional gratitude practice. But I find that just swapping the name out really changes my experience of it and allows me to think about it in a really different way. Like I think about it in almost like investment terms. There's this way that with gratitude my brain is like, “Oh, I should do that because it's good for you and then you'll be happy.” And you would think that would sell me on it, but it just fucking doesn't.
Whereas when I'm like, “Ooh, appreciating things feels really good. And it's an investment that's going to give me an ROI of more joy later.” And then I think it's also important that we just talk about neuroplasticity and neural pathways.
So whether you call it gratitude or appreciation, when you spend more time doing this, like we always say, first of all it feels fucking amazing. Second of all, you're creating more neural pathways about the light, about appreciation, about gratitude, about joy. The more time you spend noticing and enjoying what is working, the stronger those neural pathways will be.
And I think it's also worth looping back to discuss one more time, gratitude shame. Because if what you're actually practicing is gratitude shame, then the more you do that, the more even the word gratitude is going to be displeasing because it's creating an associative connection between the idea of gratitude and suffering. The idea of gratitude and shame.
So if you remember a couple episodes back, we talked about the pleasure gloss. Which is an associative connection when you like things. This is the opposite, the displeasure glass. Which is an associative connection when you dislike things.
If we try to do something over and over but it feels terrible, even thinking about doing that thing will create a terrible feeling for us and dissuade us from doing it. So if you want to have a strong gratitude or appreciation practice, you've got to make it feel good for you. If it feels like a terrible chore and makes you feel bad about yourself and feel guilty for not being happier with what you have, that's not gratitude. And you're not going to want to keep doing it because it feels terrible.
So when we think about appreciating what's going well, writing those appreciation lists or gratitude lists, if unlike me, you don't have a huge attitude problem about the word gratitude. When you think about writing those lists, it is about noticing what's working. It's about noticing what's delightful. It's about noticing what you'd like more of.
And here's a way you can think about it, if you don't appreciate what you're doing, what you've done, what's going well, why would you do more of it or get more of it, or orient your life around having more of it?
So appreciation feels really good. I know I've said that a million times. I'm just going to keep saying it a million times, because I don't think it's a point that can be overstated. But it also creates real life changes, real world changes.
If you think about someone who is trying to make a big change in their life, maybe they're trying to make a habit change, or they're working on a project. Let's just say someone's like writing a novel outside of work hours. And every day they only write for like 15 minutes.
And that's how they think of it. They're like, “Well, I only wrote for 15 minutes.” And they're like reticent. They don't want to be proud of themselves because they think that's not enough time. That's not enough effort. It's not close enough to their goal for them to be proud of themselves. Well, what does that do? What it creates is a displeasure gloss. They don't want to do more of it because the amount they're doing of it doesn't feel good now.
But if we look at it, if we just look at it factually. If we look at the data, if you're writing 15 minutes a day, that's over an hour a week. I can't do that full math in my head. But even if you're writing 10 minutes a day, that's 70 minutes a week, which is over an hour.
So 15 is like 1.5 times that. Which is let's say I think it's 105. So maybe I did do that math in my head. The math may or may not be correct, but the point is on point, okay? If you don't appreciate 5 or 10 minutes, why would you do 15 or 20? If you don't appreciate 15 or 20, why would you do 30? If you don't appreciate what is, why pursue more of it.
So when we choose to appreciate what we want to have more of, whether it's more words on our novel written. Or whether it's more dinners out with our friends like my other example. Or the ability to speak up more in meetings. Or the ability to stay calm when you receive critical feedback. Whatever it is, noticing and appreciating what's working is one of the ways you create more of it.
Appreciation creates appreciation, right? It creates the really good feeling. But it also creates the thing where we get more of it, both in the moment and in the future. Because what we appreciate, we will do more of.
And I just want to say if you're having a hard time thinking of something to appreciate, that's pretty normal because of the negativity bias. And don't let your brain come in there and shame you for that, and should you, and tell you should be more grateful, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. We all know that's not helping. It's not working. It's not making you feel better. It's not appreciation.
Here's one simple question that can help you identify things you actually appreciate, even if you're not currently noticing them. And the question is, what would past me think is a miracle that's common now? So if past you met you now, what about your current life would they think is a fucking miracle, but it's commonplace to now? You like don't even notice it.
And there can be tons of examples of this. Like, right now, my student loans are totally paid off, and I paid them off at 34. So three years ago. Past me would think that was fucking insane in a miraculous way. Younger Kori thought she was never going to pay her student loans off. She thought she was going to die with them.
And I am referring to her in the third person even though it's me. But that's because in this way we feel like such different people. I never think about my student loans anymore. When I still had them, I thought about them all the fucking time. And I thought about what a failure I was, blah, blah, blah, a bunch of unhelpful thoughts. So this thing that I never think about would be a miracle to past me.
And there's so much stuff like this in your life, right? Like another one is having my own business. Past me wanted to have her own business. She didn't want to work 40 hours a week. She wanted to do work and earn money helping people have more enjoyable, fun lives. She couldn't figure out how to do that. I mean, one of the past mes did. But the past me I'm talking about was way before that.
So I became the person who could do that. It's commonplace to me now. My business is commonplace to me now. I've been in business for three years. I still love it, but it's not the honeymoon. I don't wake up every day thinking, “Oh my god!” I'm like, “Yes, this is my life. I designed it, I'm going to have a walk. I'm glad I didn't have to get up till eight because I designed my life that way.”
But if I want to feel that appreciation and use that appreciation as fuel to do more of what I want to have done in the world, and push towards my future goals that would be a miracle to current me, but will be commonplace to future me. Asking myself this question is one way I can do that. And you can use the question too.
And no matter where you are in your life right now, there is at least one thing, the past you would think is a fucking miracle. You just have to be willing to see it, and find it, and spend more time thinking about it. Rather than letting your brain and its natural negativity bias tell you that everything's terrible and you should feel like shit all the time.
Or that your life is good and so you should be grateful, even if you want to actually change shit. And you don't actually want to be grateful for the things it's telling you to be grateful for.
So let's just review. Gratitude feels really good and amazing, but we're taught to be grateful. So sometimes when we think about gratitude, we don't feel amazing and instead we feel shitty. Which I call gratitude shame.
You need to understand which one you're doing and practice true gratitude because practicing the other one is just going to feel like shit and create more negative neural pathways. Which you're allowed to do, but I don't think it's super fun.
And if the whole idea of gratitude doesn't delight you, I offer you my ideas about appreciation and about thinking about what do you have in your life that you want more of it? And thinking about it with that like ROI like, oh, the more I notice and enjoy what I want more of, the more I'll get more of that. Both by enjoying it where it already exists, and because I will create more when I noticed how much I actually already love it.
And if you don't like either of those words, if you don't like gratitude, if you don't like appreciation, that's cool. You can still tap into this. You can do a list about what's working. You can do a list about what's amazing. You can do a list about what you like. You can do a list about what you're celebrating. It doesn't even have to be things you've done you're celebrating, you could be celebrating anything.
And you can also think about what you want to do after that. Like we talked about before with if you're making 80k a year, but you want to make 100k a year. You can list what's amazing, and what you're grateful for, or what you appreciate.
And then you can also think about like what am I doing next? And what do I want to do with these good feelings? Let me notice and enjoy what's working. And then where am I life do I want to take that fuel and what do I want to make in that area?
All right y'all, those are my ideas for you today. Take them for a test drive, see what comes up for you. And one more thing, from everything I read, doing this practice in a written format is spectacular. But I'm also a pragmatist, so do it whatever way you want to. Do it in pictures, do it in ideas, do it in words, do it in whatever you want.
One of my clients does like illustrations. Do it in illustrations. They can be stick figures, it can be spectacular. Have fun with it because that is the fucking point. Create a pleasure gloss, pair it with something that feels really good for you, rewire your brain, and see what happens. It's going to be amazing.
And if you love what I teach, and you want some help taking things a little bit deeper and figuring out how this all applies to your own life, I've got good news for you. I've got space for a few new one on one coaching clients starting this month. So let's hop on a call. I'll give you some coaching right away to help you get going. And if it seems like a good fit, I will share with you how we can work together. Just head on over to my website and click on the work with me button and get started there.
Also, bonus, my coaching offering is totally virtual so as to better serve my global audience. And yes, I do work with people who are not native English speakers and we've had great success doing that. There's even a testimonial on my website with someone in that category so you can check that out on the testimonials page. All right y'all, have a lovely week and I will talk to you next time. Bye.
Thank you for listening to Love Your Job Before You Leave It. We'll have another episode for you next week. And in the meantime, if you're feeling super fired up, head on over to korilinn.com for more guidance and resources.
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